Lazy is as lazy does

Ammunition, reloading, shooting, etc
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butlersrangers
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Lazy is as lazy does

Post by butlersrangers »

I plan on fireforming some PPU 8X56mm RS Brass in my Danish Krag this week to approximate 8X58mm rimmed Danish cartridge cases.

I want to hold the rimmed 8X56mm Brass tight against the Danish Krag's bolt-face, so that any brass 'stretching' goes forward and better forms to the chamber 'shoulder'.

'Parashooter' has shown a technique in the past that utilizes small sections of Monofilament Fishing Line.

I was going to try 'Parashooters' idea, but recently read on another forum about using small elastic bands, intended for little girls' hair.
For $1.00 for 800 at the "Dollar Store", it is worth a try!

The bands that I got fit the 8X56mm case body perfectly and bear against the case rim. The Bolt closes on the elastic band and rim with a slight springiness.

The bands have a slight looseness if put on a .30-40 or .303 British case-body, but stay in place in front of the rim, as the rifle Bolt closes with some springiness that eliminates 'free travel'.

(I will give an update on how this works out for fireforming).
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Parashooter
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Re: Lazy is as lazy does

Post by Parashooter »

Are they stiff enough to resist firing pin force and primer backthrust? (You want something relatively hard to compress.)

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butlersrangers
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Re: Lazy is as lazy does

Post by butlersrangers »

I will soon find out.

FredC
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Re: Lazy is as lazy does

Post by FredC »

I am thinking you might have a winner. The Practical Machinist website is down for maintenance. But there was a discussion of a revolver barrel shroud being held in place by the barrel threads. So the barrel had to be tensioned by driving it from the rifling?!? The fellow that was doing it made an arbor with a couple of orings on it. It was set up So the arbor would compress the O-rings expanding them into the rifling. Another contributor said that o-rings do not compress after the final tightening and were good for driving rifled pistol barrels. Who knew? If you can feel resistance closing the bolt my guess is that it will work fine.

PM is back up here is a link to the thread about using compressed O-rings to remove or install a barrel:
https://www.practicalmachinist.com/foru ... ff.401975/

FredC
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Re: Lazy is as lazy does

Post by FredC »

butlersrangers wrote: Mon May 16, 2022 1:37 am

I was going to try 'Parashooters' idea, but recently read on another forum about using small elastic bands, intended for little girls' hair.
For $1.00 for 800 at the "Dollar Store", it is worth a try!

I missed the 800 pcs for a dollar part, that is cheap. If cheap and good you certainly have a winner.

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butlersrangers
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Re: Lazy is as lazy does

Post by butlersrangers »

The elastic ring is only needed for the initial shot, to better move the brass shoulder into the forward part of the chamber.

With neck-sizing only, subsequent shots should have the case-shoulder in contact with the chamber and the base in contact with the bolt-face,
thus, minimizing case stretch.

At eight for a penny, the little rings are pretty cheap.

We'll see how things work out.

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butlersrangers
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Re: Lazy is as lazy does

Post by butlersrangers »

Saturday was a nice day for shooting, (after a relatively wet week), with good lighting, gentle wind and a temperature of 74 degrees.

I loaded up some rounds for my 8X58mmR Danish Krag, using '8X56r' Mannlicher Brass (PPU) and 7.62X54mm Russian Brass (Norma & Yugoslavian).

I do not have Dies for 8X58r, so I just use my 8mm Lebel Dies and a 7.62 Russian shell-holder.

The Lebel Sizing Die 'expander ball' opens the neck of the 7.62 Russian cases, lubricated with a light dusting of mica 'dust' on the case-mouth.
The 8mm Lebel Die is adjusted to size, about 3/4 of the neck of the 8x56r and Russian cases, so that the neck grips a .323" diameter projectile.

Since the 8X56r cases, I used, were on their second loading and were almost fully formed to the Danish chamber, I loaded them with 40 grains of IMR-3031.

The Russian cases had previously been fired in a Mosin rifle but had not been fired in the larger Danish chamber. The Brass would be experiencing a lot of 'fire forming', especially in the shoulder area.
I loaded the Russian cases with 38 grains of IMR-3031.

The cases were topped with 196 grain .323" soft point projectiles made by Privi Partizan. Bullets were seated for an Overall Cartridge Length of 2.995 inches

I slipped a small elastic hairband on each case to help hold the cartridge base against the bolt-face. This did not totally stop the fired primers from being pushed rearward, but it did reduce it.

There were no visible problems with the Brass, after firing the cartridges. The Danish Krag was pleasant to shoot using its nice iron sights at 50 yards.
Homemade targets were 7-inch diameter colorful paper plates with a 4"X4" post-it-note.

With the sight leaf set to 200 meters, the carbine shot close to point of aim. IMHO - the Danish trigger feels grittier and heavier than a good U.S. Krag trigger.

These formed cases will just be neck-sized, and the 'necks' will be annealed fairly often.

This has been a promising start! (Some of the group size and vertical stringing is likely sighting error with iron sights).

The second photo shows loaded and fired cases using 8X56r Brass. The third photo shows a loaded and fired cartridges made from 7.62 Russian Brass.
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Last edited by butlersrangers on Mon May 30, 2022 3:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

FredC
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Re: Lazy is as lazy does

Post by FredC »

As cheap and easy as those rings are, would 2 on a cartridge work better on the sizing shot?

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butlersrangers
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Re: Lazy is as lazy does

Post by butlersrangers »

Well, since the little rings survived the first firing, I reckon I can afford trying two rings, next time!

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