1892 Bolt Question

[Banjo1928]

I was given this Krag by an 80 year old uncle. It had been his fathers hunting rifle and like so many other folks, he bought it at a hardware store for an amazingly small amount of money.

It has been checked out by a gunsmith and myself and appears to be in good condition. It reportedly never had the magazine cut off which may have been removed when it was cut down. The question I have is someone who looked at it made the comment that it looked like it had the early style bolt. Im told that even though it is stamped 1894 it is a Model of 1892 manufactured in 1894. My concern is whenever I hear a comment like oh that looks like an early bolt I then wonder why did they change it? I have not fired it often but I will admit that when I have I used modern Remington 30-40 Krag ammunition. I think I understand most positions on what type of ammunition is recommended but again when someone says early bolt; did they change it because it was weak, the lug had a habit of shearing off, did it detonate like a grenade or was it changed for some less exciting reason? Im new to Krags and this forum so there may in fact be no early bolt and the guy was wrong. Any comments would be appreciated.

[FredC]

After hanging out there for a while I have never heard of bad bolts, so I do not think that will be a concern unless the bolt has been modified. Others here will have more info.

Before you go through a bunch of ammunition you will probably want to replace the missing cut off lever. I left mine out while doing a major overhaul and found it did not feed right without the lever and it really chewed on the case rims also. You will want to be nice to your brass if you want to reload, also you do not want all the brass shavings in the action. Before you buy one you might look inside the action to see if some kind of clipped off one is installed already.

[butlersrangers]

'Banjo1928': Welcome to the KCA Forum. Neat old Family Krag!

Your 1894 dated rifle started life as a model 1892 Krag-Jorgensen. It later received model 1896 'updates': the 1896 rear-sight, the 'hold-open' pin that projects on the right-side of the extractor spring, and the 'hold-open' notch on the top of the receiver.

Your bolt is the type that was issued in 1894. There was nothing wrong with them. The machining just changed as the Krag evolved. (Later bolts will fit in earlier Krags, but, early bolts will not work in later 1898 Krags, due to machining changes in the model 1898 receiver's 'bolt handle recess'). Your bolt sleeve is an early type with its shallow machined grooves (almost appear like threads) and the long extractor spring is retained on the bolt sleeve with a screw. Later bolts used a pin to retain the extractor.

Someone made your model 1892 (updated to model 1896) Krag infantry rifle into a handy 'Hunting' carbine. U.S. .30-40 Krag factory ammo is loaded for lower pressures and should be safe in your Krag.

The Krag magazine cut-off evolved and there are three main types. All three will work with your receiver. (The later, model 1898 receiver, can only accept the 'short-shaft' model). The cut-off fills a groove in the receiver wall. As 'FredC' said, cartridge feed may be a bit rough without the cut-off present.

(BTW - It is a good idea Not to Remove that little flat spring from the large extractor. It is crimped in place and it is unnecessary to remove it to clean and maintain).

[Banjo1928]

Thanks much for the info. A lot of facts and fast wow. This is particularly helpful as I have looked at magazine cut off levers for sale but had no idea which years might fit. As to the flat spring, if it was ever crimped in place its lost its crimp. On reassembly I had to use a small dab of grease to hold it in place as every time I turned the bolt over it would fall out. I put five rounds through the gun after I put it all back together and it seemed fine but if there is a repair I need to do on the flat spring I will and now that I have a better idea on what I have I will track down if I can the proper magazine cut off lever.

[FredC]

I just looked at to extractors lying around the shop and could not see any evidence of a crimp. I think that spring may have been originally press fit?
Both the extractor and spring are spring tempered which my way of thinking would make them difficult to crimp without breaking them.
If they were originally press fit and lost the press fit maybe a Loctite like 2760 would hold it in. If other knowledgeable members concur, I would do a thorough cleaning with solvent and maybe a soft wire to scape the gunk out but not enlarge the slot and hole in the extractor. Give the Loctite time to set and try it out, I would watch it for a while to make sure it stays put.

[Banjo1928]

I have had great luck with Loctite on other milsurps to hold bits in place. Sometimes the official fix is pretty scary "Just use a ball peen hammer and flatten those splines down a bit" No thank you no ball peen hammer, loctite much safer. If the little spring is supposed to fit tight I'm on board with cleaning the surface and using loctite unless others see a downside.

[butlersrangers]

I think you guys are on to a good 'fix'. I am sure FredC is right and that the small spring was a press fit into the extractor.

I am sure loctite, JB Weld, or epoxy glue would all work to restore the tight fit and retain the small flat-spring in position.

[Mark_Daiute]

where is the flat spring on an extractor? I thought the extractor was one piece.

I just bought and installed an extractor and did not notice the spring.

I just looked at the photo above and there IS a flat spring that looks like it has the hold open pin on it...

My god, if the hold open pin is not built into the extractor I had no idea!

Thanks.

[butlersrangers]

Mark: The Krag extractor is a long flat spring with a 'claw' at the front. The rear of the extractor is anchored to the bolt-sleeve with a screw or rivet, depending on model.

There are also two smaller parts pressed into the sides of the long extractor. On the right top is the 'hold open pin'. On the left side, toward the front, is a flat spring about 1 5/16" long.

This small spring catches a 'ledge' machined into the receiver. The purpose of this spring appears to be to help guide the tip of the extractor and to assist keeping a downward pressure on the extractor 'claw'.

"Banjo's" photos showed this small flat spring removed from its seat in the long extractor.

[Mark_Daiute]

had no idea. I thought the extractor was one single part, had no idea the hold open pin was not one with the extractor. Any seams are invisible.

OK just pulled a bolt, and can see how the pin is is pushed in as well as that small spring.