First Krag 1899 Carbine

[IHCGarand]

Hello everybody, new to the forum and new to the Krag. Wanted one for awhile but pretty much standard rifles around here and nothing really excited me. Then this guy popped up on a local auction and I brought it home. It's an 1899 Carbine, serial #288898. Pictures were horrible for the auction with no preview day. But it looked good. Nice bluing and bore. Seems to have everything right, headless cocking knob, 1900 cartouche and and the circle P. But, after looking closer at home, it seems to have the 1902 Rifle sight from what I've gathered reading here on the forum. There is no C stamp anywhere and it has a peep aperture. If that is the case, is the front sight right? What is the realistic chance of finding a nice 1898 Carbine sight and what do they usual go for? Thanks!

[IHCGarand]

Pics 2

[IHCGarand]

Pics 3

[butlersrangers]

IHCGarand - Welcome to the KCA Forum!

That is a nice looking U.S. model 1899 Carbine. Your wood and metal look attractive.

Your Krag carbine, serial number 288898, would have been assembled around October or November of 1900.

Your current rear-sight is not correct; it is a model 1902 rifle sight.
Your current front-blade appears to be a rifle blade and will probably measure around .413", (not including the sight-base).
1899 carbine front-sight blades normally measure around .355" in height, (when removed from the base).

Your carbine was first assembled after the model 1898 '3-notch' sight was discontinued and made obsolete.
The carbine and rifle versions of the model 1898 sight were calibrated for a faster and more powerful .30-40 cartridge, which was withdrawn from service due to damage to Bolt-Lugs.

Your carbine was produced in the second lot or 'batch' of model 1899 carbines.
It is believed these carbines were initially fitted with a model 1896 carbine rear-sight and a handguard with a sight-protecting 'hump'.

Eventually, most U.S. Krag carbines were updated and fitted with model 1901 and model 1902 carbine rear-sights.

Your carbine has the handguard that works with the model 1902 carbine rear-sight.
Only about 1,000 of the model 1902 carbine rear-sights were made.
They are hard to find and sell for about $250 to $300.

[scottz63]

Nice carbine! Welcome here as well!

[IHCGarand]

Thank you for thebwelcome and the great information! The army rebuild program wouldn't have put a standard rifle sight on would they? Since the front sight looks to be a rifle sight then someone knew what they were doing? Possibly? Is there a difference between the 2 different time periods this handguard was used? It also makes me wonder about if the headless cocking knob being legit. The gentlemen who had the guns on the auction has Alzheimer's and so the information has been lost. Was this modified by the CMP if it came from there by chance? He had a couple other CMP guns from the 60's~70's.

[Whig]

No one in any official capacity would inappropriately mount a rear rifle sight on a carbine.

[scottz63]

"It also makes me wonder about if the headless cocking knob being legit."

It might be. This was discussed a couple of days ago. From what I learned from that conversation, ending serial number range for that is somewhere around 288000, near yours. Info was from butlersrangers. He may have more to add about this.

[Whig]

The headless cocking piece was first thought to have only been used on Model 1899 carbines. They were actually used on Model 1898 Krag rifles also until around October 1900 around serial number 285,000 - 288,000. Your Krag, serial number 288898, is slightly later but right around this time. Some Krag Model 1898 rifles that have appeared perfectly original with serial numbers in the 290,XXX range have had the headless cocking piece mounted. This exact cutoff is uncertain. Whereas it may have been original, yours also could have been changed somewhere down the line by someone outside of an arsenal or armory. I think they look kind of cool and like them although they are harder to use if you want to pull it back to cock the action.

[butlersrangers]

IIRC - The manufacture of the 'headless' cocking-piece was ordered discontinued in October 1900.

It is conceivable that a good number of these part 'variants' were in inventory, or being completed,
while the 'knobbed' cocking-piece was put back in production.

It seems realistic to me that a few thousand Krags, above serial number 285000, would have gotten the 'headless' cocking-piece, until the supply ran out.

Of course the OP's model 1899 Krag action, number 288898, may have been pulled out of a parts bin and assembled into a carbine, before number 285000.
U.S. Krags were not assembled in numerical order.

(They stopped making the 'headless' cocking-piece because it cost more. It did work 'OK' and was interchangeable.
They didn't scrap them, the part got used & reused).