M1898 Identification

[osageviper138]

Hey all,

I’ve seen several posts on Reddit this week of Krags and it’s gotten me going down the rabbit trail with a rifle my grandfather gave me years ago. Keep in mind, I’m very much a beginner and don’t really know much about this rifle. I’d like to hope and think it’s a M1898 carbine but I think I know it’s just been bubba’d out. I came here looking for opinions on what y’all think I’ve got and what I might need to do to get it into a close issued condition. Obviously I’m not going to find a properly cartouched stock but I’d like it to at least look the part, even if it means changing barrel and stock. My rifle has a 22 inch barrel and the 18 elevation leaf sight and is not “C” marked. It’s got a serial number that is close to the range as the carbines for that year but the stock and barrel band obviously doesn’t support that. Adding to that, the muzzle crown definitely seems like it’s just been chopped. Furthermore, I saw a post highlighting a 1914 Bannerman catalog that seems to show nearly exactly what I've got. I guess the question is, do I have a carbine or a cutdown rifle? Thanks for your help and your time!

[osageviper138]

Additional pictures that wouldn't fit on the original post.

[osageviper138]

And the last set

[Zac952]

What you have there is what I believe to be a cutdown rifle, I looked at the front sight block and it doesn't look as professionally fitted as what came out of the armory. The stock is what appears to be a Springfield 1903 stock as noted by the filled in floor plate, odd left side, and the crossbolt. This seems more like a Bannerman Krag to me as Bannerman commonly put krags into surplused 1903 stocks. That is an 1896 rifle sight and handguard
Interestingly your butplate had no trapdoor, I can not tell from the picture, but this may be either some random buttplate that bannerman used or it could be an original 1892 Krag buttplate, if you remove it look for there to be bosses for the trapdoor hinge, if there isn't any and it is completely flat then you may have an original 1892 Krag buttplate, others will likely chime in

[butlersrangers]

'Osageviper' - It appears your Krag is a combination of parts put together by Bannerman's. Your handguard and bolt-sleeve/safety are for the model 1892 Krag rifle.

Your barrel is a 30" rifle barrel that was cut to 22 inches and had its front-sight remounted.

The rear sight is a model 1896 rifle sight.

Your stock is fabricated from a 1903 Springfield stock.

These pieced together Krags were first offered around 1914. They were being sold into the 1940's by Hudson's Sporting Goods in N.Y.

(I don't know if all the receivers were in a fire and re-heat treated as described in the 1914 advertisement)?

[osageviper138]

Gentlemen,

Thank you very much for the quick reply and all of the info! I would’ve never been able to put all that together. I figured it had been cut down but I didn’t realize that it had been frankenrifled to that degree. Looks like I’ll have a bit of work to do in getting this poor thing back into shape. But before I do that, I’m thinking I may take this to a reputable gunsmith to test the integrity of the receiver before I put all that work into it. Not sure if it’s a good idea to be shooting a fire damaged receiver, even if it’s been retreated, not to mention the overall age of the rifle anyways.

[Whig]

Osage,

That is quite the unusual Krag conglomeration rifle you have. You are wise to have it checked out first before trying to use it. Never know what has been done to the inner workings, bolt, chamber, bore of the rifle since so much has changed externally and it is over 120 years old! Your Krag was manufactured originally by Springfield Armory around July 1898. A lot has happened to it since it was born. It is fascinating to have such an amazing piece of history that survived completely through the 20th Century! Shooting these historic pieces is even more exciting!

Also, something to consider, it would take a lot to make this more "correct" as the Krag that it once was and will never be able to be a valuable military configuration Krag since it has been cut down. Replacing some parts won't do a lot of good and cost a lot. It would be better to save some money and search for a more correct Krag if you want one. You could wipe the stock down, after removing it from the rifle (ask us how if interested!) with denatured alcohol to get rid of the varnish that has bubbled up in areas and coat it with boiled linseed oil to improve the looks of the wood. I'd keep it as it is, though, because of your family history with it.

What is more important, though, is that you have a family treasure, regardless of what condition it is in, that most people don't have. Since you shared this with your grandfather from years ago, that makes this rifle a real priceless treasure that you can enjoy and maybe pass down further in your family. Those are the best things to keep!

Whatever you chose, keep us informed and we'll help along the way. Thanks for sharing!

[butlersrangers]

I agree with 'Whig'. There is a good case to leave your 'Family Krag' as is. The Bannerman ersatz Krag carbines are an interesting story in their own right.

BTW - You did a great job of providing useful photos of your Krag!

A good Krag book to have would be "The Krag Rifle", by Lt. Col. William S. Brophy. Now out-of-print, 'used' copies show up on eBay.

Here is the relevant material on your family heirloom.